Most Terrifying Thought Experiment?

Quote Originally Posted by mark_samuels

I think most of us in the West, myself included, are already half-slaves to technology. A guy I know (who works at Apple CorpTM) was speechless when I told him his account of a conference to launch some new gadget or other sounded very much like going to a church service.

Those Apple fanatics are the Pentecostals of technology enthusiasts.

Quote Originally Posted by mark_samuels

But honestly, AI? It'll all go the way of SETI, believe me. Mark S.

Nope. Why would anyone believe you about AI?

This is a novel idea, especially in the U.S., but I tend to believe real scientists when it comes to science, and not politicians, political pundits masquerading as news anchors, or theologians, all of whom specialize in lying, either by design or by ignorance. It makes no difference, a liar is a liar.

The proliferation of information due to technology marks the beginning of The Second Enlightenment. Superstition will fall away like so much chaff. And in the end NO gods shall survive.

The already near-empty churches will fall to ruin. The psychologically handicapped will be removed from the public square as society will no longer tolerate their hobbling about and passing out crutches because they assume that everyone is riddled with the same infirmities as they are. They will be objects of shame to be locked away in attics to no longer trouble our gaze. No more pestering evangelizing, just shrieking things to be shunned and despised.

Quote Originally Posted by Forgotten Prisoner

The proliferation of information due to technology marks the beginning of The Second Enlightenment. Superstition will fall away like so much chaff. And in the end NO gods shall survive. The already near-empty churches will fall to ruin. The psychologically handicapped will be removed from the public square as society will no longer tolerate their marching about and handing out crutches because they assume that everyone is riddled with the same infirmities as they are. They will be objects of shame to be locked away in attics, out of sight. No more pestering evangelizing, just shrieking things to be shunned and despised.

Ha! You've clearly never been to the U.S. Here, superstition and belief in the magical Sky Daddy (or even more troubling and less savory entities) are the rule, not the exception. Yes, in Europe church attendance is down, but judging from some of the obvious Europeans here, slavish devotion to murky thinking is alive and well there also.

Were it not so.

Quote Originally Posted by bendk

Quote Originally Posted by Howarth Why do you disagree? EDIT: Chomsky never really directly addresses the question of consciousness/self-awareness. His comment about humanity being an evolutionary error (about 26:45) is highly revealing, though. Happens that there's no such thing. Evolution is a theory, not a value judgment. Derp. I think it is clear what Chomsky meant by humanity being an evolutionary mistake. Cioran and Ligotti have made similar comments about consciousness.

Yes, it's clear. They all make unwarranted judgment calls about a theoretical description of a natural process (evolution) which is indifferent to human existence, let alone whether we could possibly be some sort of "mistake". To have a mistake, there must be an intentional goal. There ain't.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SuukrcJuHXw#t=6218 From 1:43:40 to 1:51:00 is about AI and The Singularity.

Vague statements and firm predictions unsubstantiated by any kind of evidence other than "we're not unique" (agreed) and "we're unraveling cognitive architecture" (fine). His argument is philosophical, that machine intelligence won't be inherently any different than human intelligence (I agree). What he doesn't demonstrate is that they're anywhere close to achieving it. Which is probably for the best. "Ineluctable progress of technology over time," seems to be his best gambit. He's full of ####. He's a scifi fanboy with a physics degree, a corporate cheerleader with a middlin' good line of bull.

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Jeff Hawkins, a computer and neuroscientist, makes an interesting case for a new theory of consciousness. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6CVj5IQkzk

I don't do TEDTalks. Another fundraising pimp.

Quote

I guess it really boils down to who you believe and why.

No, it boils down to whether you're gullible... And why.

[gveranon]

Quote Originally Posted by Forgotten Prisoner

The proliferation of information due to technology marks the beginning of The Second Enlightenment. Superstition will fall away like so much chaff. And in the end NO gods shall survive. The already near-empty churches will fall to ruin. The psychologically handicapped will be removed from the public square as society will no longer tolerate their marching about and handing out crutches because they assume that everyone is riddled with the same infirmities as they are. They will be objects of shame to be locked away in attics, out of sight. No more pestering evangelizing, just shrieking things to be shunned and despised.

Forgotten Prisoner, you have missed your calling. You should be preaching hellfire sermons about Judgment Day and performing exorcisms on the unsaved.

[Druidic]

Just read this quote from Tom Petty in U.S.A. Today:
"The challenge is going to be maintaining our humanity alongside technology that is moving really fast," he says. "If you let some kid invent artificial intelligence that updates itself, then you're in trouble. You don't want to invent a bigger brain and put it in a bear."

Now that is funny.

[bendk]

Quote Originally Posted by Howarth

Quote Originally Posted by bendk Quote Originally Posted by Howarth Why do you disagree? EDIT: Chomsky never really directly addresses the question of consciousness/self-awareness. His comment about humanity being an evolutionary error (about 26:45) is highly revealing, though. Happens that there's no such thing. Evolution is a theory, not a value judgment. Derp. I think it is clear what Chomsky meant by humanity being an evolutionary mistake. Cioran and Ligotti have made similar comments about consciousness. Yes, it's clear. They all make unwarranted judgment calls about a theoretical description of a natural process (evolution) which is indifferent to human existence, let alone whether we could possibly be some sort of "mistake". To have a mistake, there must be an intentional goal. There ain't.

What I think they are saying is that humanity is a unique, unfavorable aberration in the natural world. I don't think goals enter into it.

Quote Originally Posted by bendk

Quote Originally Posted by Howarth https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SuukrcJuHXw#t=6218 From 1:43:40 to 1:51:00 is about AI and The Singularity. Vague statements and firm predictions unsubstantiated by any kind of evidence other than "we're not unique" (agreed) and "we're unraveling cognitive architecture" (fine). His argument is philosophical, that machine intelligence won't be inherently any different than human intelligence (I agree). What he doesn't demonstrate is that they're anywhere close to achieving it. Which is probably for the best. "Ineluctable progress of technology over time," seems to be his best gambit. He's full of ####. He's a scifi fanboy with a physics degree, a corporate cheerleader with a middlin' good line of bull.

That scifi fanboy just sold two quantum computers for 10 million bucks apiece. And he did say that "within five years" they will have demonstrable AI that will make people question our unique place in the universe. He has to maintain some discretion when it comes to future products. He doesn't strike me as being a scam artist. He said earlier in the interview that they are not taking their company public. If he wanted to cash in he could do it now. People are chomping at the bit to buy stock in this company, and despite this the company still raised close to 100 million dollars from private investors.

Quote Originally Posted by bendk

Quote Originally Posted by Howarth Jeff Hawkins, a computer and neuroscientist, makes an interesting case for a new theory of consciousness. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6CVj5IQkzk I don't do TEDTalks. Another fundraising pimp.

I like TEDTalks. The condensed lectures expose you to ideas that you may want to explore in greater depth later. Again, Jeff Hawkins doesn't need the money and his neuroscience company is a research/nonprofit organization. It might be better if you knew who these people were before insulting them.

Quote Originally Posted by bendk

Quote Originally Posted by Howarth I guess it really boils down to who you believe and why. No, it boils down to whether you're gullible... And why.

lol. I've been accused of many things, but being gullible ain't one of 'em. But guess what? I choose to believe them instead of you. See, I was right after all.

Quote Originally Posted by Forgotten Prisoner

The psychologically handicapped will be removed from the public square as society will no longer tolerate their hobbling about and passing out crutches because they assume that everyone is riddled with the same infirmities as they are. They will be objects of shame to be locked away in attics to no longer trouble our gaze. No more pestering evangelizing, just shrieking things to be shunned and despised.

You're becoming increasingly tolerant of theists, FP! Last time around you advocated forced lobotomies if they refused to conform to atheism, so this new program is positively liberal in comparison. Good for you. Who knows where your journey of discovery will end?

Mark S.

[Justin Isis]

Quote Originally Posted by Druidic

Just read this quote from Tom Petty in U.S.A. Today: "The challenge is going to be maintaining our humanity alongside technology that is moving really fast," he says. "If you let some kid invent artificial intelligence that updates itself, then you're in trouble. You don't want to invent a bigger brain and put it in a bear."

The bear could be called Clever Charles or something like that. He has to take over the world using only superior intelligence and the limitations of being a bear. He can't go anywhere in person because he's a bear and can't talk, and people will call authorities if they see him moving around in public. Presumably his AI consciousness allows him to access the Internet mentally (i.e. he is some kind of cybernetic brain in a bear body), so he communicates exclusively through email, Twitter and Facebook. He comes 95% close to taking over the world by manipulating financial markets but gives up after experiencing crushing indifference and lethargy which eventually result in hibernation

[Druidic]

Quote

The bear could be called Clever Charles or something like that. He has to take over the world using only superior intelligence and the limitations of being a bear. He can't go anywhere in person because he's a bear and can't talk, and people will call authorities if they see him moving around in public. Presumably his AI consciousness allows him to access the Internet mentally (i.e. he is some kind of cybernetic brain in a bear body), so he communicates exclusively through email, Twitter and Facebook. He comes 95% close to taking over the world by manipulating financial markets but gives up after experiencing crushing indifference and lethargy which eventually result in hibernation -- Justin Isis.

“Poor Clever Charles! I understand he did a short stint before the end in a traveling carnival as “Chuck the Amazing Mathematical Bear”... until the antidepressants stopped working completely. The authorities tried to pass the tragic event off as an accident but everything points, I fear, to an intentional suicide by hunter. Nevertheless, the Science boys were still encouraged overall. His manipulation of the Market was brilliant. I understand next time they’re going to try it with a Bull.”

More Brains!

The Science Community’s Fight Over an Artificial Brain - The Daily Beast

Mark S.