Your favourite song at the moment..

[Viva June]

Quote Originally Posted by MadsPLP

What irritates me is most of all that a lot of the criticism is generated by hearsay without any smoking gun. For instance, one hears constantly that some member No Remorse played with Wakeford, but I have never seen any proof of that - it's just a rumour that's been recirculated over and over again.

True, the allegations lose all substance once they go into actual political territory. Most of them seem to stop at the unease some people feel when confronted with certain symbols, images and lyrical concerns. I guess you can make the argument that art is always already political, but then you still have to provide a convincing textual analysis.

[sundog]

Quote Originally Posted by MadsPLP

when you're playing with fire, you might get burnt. And justly so.

Can't we just go into the peaceful snow?
Where our bridges burn..
Where our bridges burn and glow..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wxbln9gst6c&feature=feedf

[skeptic]

Quote Originally Posted by MadsPLP

It's not the asking of questions - it's more the lack of willingness to aknowledge that aesthetics does not necessarily influence one's political views.

At the risk of derailing this thread any further MadsPLP, my view is that even if aesthetics could be divorced from politics in the manner you suggest, it would be irresponsible for artists to do so, particularly in cases where the chosen aesthetic is so politically charged. This applies, I think, whether their audience is ten or ten thousand. Having said that, my main complaint with latter-day DIJ and the contemporary neo-folk scene is that the music and its packaging now simply recycle the same self-parodying set of musical and thematic vacuities ad infinitum: for me at least it is, in a word, dull.

I don't know about "at the moment" exactly, but here's a favourite folk song:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwGokKfLylI

[MadsPLP]

Quote Originally Posted by skeptic

Quote Originally Posted by MadsPLP It's not the asking of questions - it's more the lack of willingness to aknowledge that aesthetics does not necessarily influence one's political views. At the risk of derailing this thread any further MadsPLP, my view is that even if aesthetics could be divorced from politics in the manner you suggest, it would be irresponsible for artists to do so, particularly in cases where the chosen aesthetic is so politically charged. This applies, I think, whether their audience is ten or ten thousand. Having said that, my main complaint with latter-day DIJ and the contemporary neo-folk scene is that the music and its packaging now simply recycle the same self-parodying set of musical and thematic vacuities ad infinitum: for me at least it is, in a word, dull.

It may be best reserved for another time (and it's a subject I'm quite tired of, I must admit).

I do believe that aesthetics doesn't necessarily influence one's political views. Wearing a suit doesn't make one a conservative, and I doubt that wearing baggy pants makes anyone a proponent of the gang politics popular in certain sub-genres of hip hop. Liking a certain aesthetics can very well, and often, be apolitical. I can assure you that my own sporting of nylon shirts, preferably of the Nik Nik-brand, has nothing to do with my left-leaning political beliefs.

Aesthetics isn't necessarily always apolitical, but it can very well be, and is often, and also in the neofolk scene; that doesn't mean that certain aesthetics doesn't have political connotations for either the wearer or the viewer, but all that, for instance, Death in June's use of uniforms tells me is that Douglas P. has a fondness for a certain type of aesthetics, and that's really all it tells me.

That being said, I do wish that neofolk bands would stop using that particular aesthetics, seeing as it's artistic value is long gone, if ever it did have any. Unfortunately, it seems to be something of a scene cliché, like so many other scene clichés. It always baffles me that people are using dubious symbols and aesthetics just because of a scene convention - it shares some traits with heavy metal in that respect (although, of course, the aesthetic conventions of heavy metal are pretty rad, as shown by this drawing:

)

It's rather ironic when neofolk bands claim to be an intellectual culture, well-read, educated subculture, yet only namedropping the same 5-10 writers, making derivative music, and seemingly only interested in a rather vague ambigiousness when making interviews. I personally think that pursuing this particular set of aesthetics is a dead end, and I'm glad to see at least some neofolk bands moving away from them (and neofolk, and veering into psych/progressive folk territories).

I agree in general with your viewpoint on later Death in June and current neofolk. Although I rather like the new Death in June album, in spite of it's cheesyness, rather awful lyrics and rehashing of worn out themes - I tend to agree with a lot of points raised by the review of the latest album: http://www.popmatters.com/pm/review/...wlounge-corps/ , only I rather like the album and the songwriting. But then again: I've always had a fondness for a lot of rather bad music.

[Odalisque]

I love this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6oXfv6MbgE

But, then, I would. ;)

[Odalisque]

Here's a shorter version of the same song, but with a Manga video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzOdDWpdLoM

[sundog]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5xrHu1YBfg&feature=fl_lolz&playnext=1&list=FLdDhQWtEBVJw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPPtrqvHGEg

Mark S.

[trieffiewiles]

Perhaps the sickest-humored band that ever existed. Listen to one or more of the albums from start to finish, that is, if you can stand his incredibly piercing voice; Temple of the Morning Star, In the Eyes of God, or Sadness Will Prevail- they took derangement to a level no other relatively mainstream band went. Not something one can listen to all the time, but I am on a self-destructive kick right now.

TODAY IS THE DAY - "The Descent" - YouTube

[Sam]

Quote Originally Posted by trieffiewiles

Perhaps the sickest-humored band that ever existed. Listen to one or more of the albums from start to finish, that is, if you can stand his incredibly piercing voice; Temple of the Morning Star, In the Eyes of God, or Sadness Will Prevail- they took derangement to a level no other relatively mainstream band went. Not something one can listen to all the time, but I am on a self-destructive kick right now.

Wow, that takes me back. Saw these guys open for the mighty Surgery almost 20 years ago in a long-gone San Francisco club. I had never heard of them and remember thinking they were pretty out there, even for the whole warped Amphetamine Reptile axis. Judging by that video, I'd say they were just getting started...

Can't say as I remember a lot of details of that show, for a variety of reasons, time being just one... Today Is The Day played first and were something like chaos incarnate, then Chokebore came out and played their off-kilter but appealing take on punk, then Surgery rocked like few bands I have seen before or since. I still have the Surgery "pelvic wrench" shirt I bought there.

To complete the long-ago ghost concert that is now raging anew in my brain, here is Chokebore then Surgery playing a couple of catchy little ditties.

Chokebore - Coat - YouTube

Surgery - Little Debbie - YouTube