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Old 04-23-2017   #841
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Re: Trump

Quote Originally Posted by Evans View Post
Quote Originally Posted by Shadenuat View Post
@James
I don't think that Aickman was at all liberal in real life, tho. Like, at all. If anything, I can imagine him being amused by the fact that folks who read him or are inspired by him nowadays tend to be liberal. Back in the day, his fiction was even championed by the likes of Russell Kirk, well known far right ideologue.
By no stretch of the imagination could Kirk be called 'far right', he was a Traditionalist Burkean Conservative.
Russell Kirk's The Conservative Mind: From Burke to Santayana is a masterpiece of intellectual history. I'm more of a wishy-washy centrist than a conservative, but I loved this book. It is just as remote from today's populist, money-and-power-obsessed GOP as it is from modern progressivism.

Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Veech View Post
I now understand why Borges refrained from politics. It seems a waste of one's precious time.
I ran across a quotation several years ago that I think about from time to time:

"I am not so devoid of all talents as to occupy myself with politics." --Anatole France
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Old 04-24-2017   #842
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Re: Trump

Quote Originally Posted by Shadenuat View Post
Quote Originally Posted by Evans View Post
By no stretch of the imagination could Kirk be called 'far right', he was a Traditionalist Burkean Conservative.
50(000) Shades of Conservatism. I'm not the sort of guy who likes to contemplate inner workings of evil, so I apologize if I misplaced the gentleman in question.
I'll tell you this about Kirk, I enjoyed his constantly reprinted "There's a Long, Long Trail A-Winding" for it is atmospheric and beautifully written story. But I am not at all inclined to read anything else of his, and I have precisely zero interest in studying his particular system of assholery.
The refrain from commenting on it? Or better yet refrain from commenting on politics as a whole; If you can't bear to gain an even superficial comprehension of an idea you disagree with it's best to avoid commenting on it in toto.

Think of those Americans of a certain generation who shut down anyone who supports a modicum of state welfare with the cry of 'Commie'.
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Old 04-24-2017   #843
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Re: Trump

None of the conservatives I personally know like Trump. He represents everything that is hateful and repugnant about modernity and the corporate disinclination towards a strain of traditionalism that cannot be monetised. I am considered a conservative by some for many of my views not regarding economics, but I don't see anything worthy of praise about Trump. I scarcely understand how he is even considered a conservative. Strikes me as partisan American consumerist nonsense. They appear to have elected a Big Mac into office.

'I believe in what the Germans term Ehrfurcht: reverence for things one cannot understand.'
― Robert Aickman, An Essay
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Old 04-24-2017   #844
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Re: Trump

Trump is another Bush-grade NeoCon, doubt that anyone can deny that at this point. Of course, we now see his followers defending his blatant NeoConry even tho his supposed opposition to it was perhaps his biggest selling point.
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Old 04-24-2017   #845
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Re: Trump

Well, of course he is, but then they'd have to admit they threw away all they claimed to believe in for the sake of populism.

'I believe in what the Germans term Ehrfurcht: reverence for things one cannot understand.'
― Robert Aickman, An Essay
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Old 04-24-2017   #846
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Re: Trump

My response to a question Mr. Veech asked earlier--

I admired the Old Time Liberals, the guys who believed in debate and would never shut down an opponent's voice. The guys who knew that Equality was not an absurd ideal if you believed in equality in the eyes of the law, the only equality that counts. The guys who weren't that different from Conservatives like Russel Kirk. Guys of common sense. Guys who hated war but would fight if a time of war ever came.

The new intollerant breed of Leftists grew out of the far left supporters of Stalin in the 30's and 40's as well as the radical student movement of the sixties. They're impossible to debate and have nothing in common with the True Liberal. Insults, not facts, is their first line of defense. They delight in ad hominem attacks. The Old Guys, the Good Guys, are fading. Sad but inescapably true.
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Old 04-24-2017   #847
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Re: Trump

Quote Originally Posted by Druidic View Post
My response to a question Mr. Veech asked earlier--

I admired the Old Time Liberals, the guys who believed in debate and would never shut down an opponents voice. The guys who knew that Equality was not an absurd ideal if you believed in equality in the eyes of the law, the only equality that counts. The guys who weren't that different from Conservatives like Russel Kirk. Guys of common sense. Guys who hated war but would fight if a time of war ever came.

The new intollerant breed of Leftists grew out of the far left supporters of Stalin in the 30's and 40's as well as the the radical students of the sixties. They're impossible to debate and have nothing in common with the True Liberal. Sad but inescapably true.
I agree wholeheartedly with your statement, Druidic. As a child of the '60s I've seen firsthand the benefits, and then the perversion of liberalism as it morphed into a rigid Leftist ideology becoming more and more militant with every passing day. I believe that public education played a large part, and was self-admittedly part of the hard Left's strategy. The problem was that nobody took them seriously thinking that a strong parental/familial influence would prevail. As the divorce rate grew and the familial unit weakened this was no longer the case, and children were much more vulnerable to outside influences. Now, if that rate were to drop to 0.0 it wouldn't matter, because the damage has been done. The dumbing down of America and its culture began over fifty years ago.

Lucian pigeon-holed the letter solemnly in the receptacle lettered 'Barbarians.' ~ The Hill of Dreams by Arthur Machen

“The wallpaper and I are fighting a duel to the death. One or the other of us has to go.” – Oscar Wilde
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Old 04-24-2017   #848
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Re: Trump

Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Veech View Post
I now understand why Borges refrained from politics.
Wasn't he a supporter of some nasty politicians?

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Old 04-24-2017   #849
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Re: Trump

Borges made one or two comments that could be interrupted as support of Augusto Pinochet. (They cost him the Nobel Prize, so much for objectivity on the part of the judges). Borges' remarks have to be regarded in context: the alternative to Pinochet--the Marxists-- seemed far worse.
Pinochet's hand could be brutal and his boys were murderous to perceived enemies, real or imagined; but during his iron rule came the revival of Chile, what has been known as"The Miracle of Chile." It's too damn complex to go into here.

Last edited by Druidic; 04-24-2017 at 02:57 PM..
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Old 04-24-2017   #850
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Re: Trump

Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Veech View Post
My own view is that most Americans are not content with a sandwich or hot dog - they want a steak dinner. This includes CEOs, government bureaucrats, and (gasp!) the average American. We're all so very, very spoiled, and very few of us have any genuine desire to become disciplined. It's the Roman Empire all over again. The rest of the world has been laughing at us long before the advent of Trump. They've been laughing at us because we're essentially pigs drowning in our own slop.
At the same time, I can't totally castigate the idea of decadence. Let's face it, it often provides the impetuous for great art (though this could be the Huysmans in me speaking). And while I work hard at what I do, if someone offered me the opportunity to spend the rest of my days drifting down the Nile in a pleasure barge, surrounded by jewel-encrusted tortoises and (whilst reading first edition Ligotti books bound in dried human skin) being fanned by oiled-up and naked slave boys, I'd take it in a heart beat!

"The Outsider must find a direction and commit himself to it, not lie moping about the meaninglessness of the world."
-Colin Wilson, Religion and the Rebel
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