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Old 03-06-2017   #71
Mithras
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Re: The Supernatural

The word paradise etymologically descends from the Avestan word pairidaeza, meaning "walled garden", and was most likely an influence on the tranquil descriptions of Garden of Eden.

Correction: After thinking more, I believe the idea of paradise associated exclusively with gardens came by way of Sumerians first, but the idea of an earthy paradise associated with 'leisure' or 'goodness' descends from Zoroastrian influence.

Moreover, the word magic derives from the Greek phrase "magike tekhne", and it refers to the "art of Zoroastrian priests", such as their divinatory, astrological, and alchemical practices.

In a sense, Zarathustra's magike tekhne cursed the West into seeing the illusion of pairidaeza and, subsequently, good and evil within the machinery of thing as Nietszsche posited: "Zarathustra was the first to consider the fight of good and evil the very wheel in the machinery of things: the transposition of morality into the metaphysical realm, as a force, cause, and end in itself, is his work. [...] Zarathustra created this most calamitous error, morality; consequently, he must also be the first to recognize it. [...]"

The idea of progress towards greater truth also originates here.

We are living in magic whenever we use darkness as a metaphor for bleakness, chaos, ignorance, or evil as contrasted to the lightness of serenity, order, knowledge, or goodness. One of the greatest horrors involves subverting and exposing their relative character within an indifferent Becoming (i.e., "Black Lodge and White Lodge are one"), at least to me because I personally do not like transvaluation of values.

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Old 03-09-2017   #72
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Re: The Supernatural

Zarathustra's influence was far more widespread than either Jesus or Muhammad. Neither Jesus nor Muhammad were interesting figures, and the former had megalomania and the latter was a warlord.

The whole existence of the White and Black Lodge was instantiated by Zarathustra and then spread through waves of influence that the introduction of my short story collection goes into. Even pessimistically saying White and Black Lodge are One resembles Zurvanism, which had materialist and aesthetic strands of thought! The Zoroastrian tradition had far more depth and nuance than either Muslims or Christians can fathom, but I would agree the Greek philosophers were better because they introduced influential dialectics rooted purely in reason, which anti-foundationalists challenge now.

Both Islam and Christianity are Abrahamic perversions of Zoroastrianism, and Judaism too developed much of its ideology from contact with this glorious tradition, which is now being reduced to rubble.

People who talk of an Anti-Arab sentiment are foolish. There is, however, a new strand of Anti-Persian sentiment that attempts to deny the impact of Greater Iran's pre-Islamic legacy.

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Old 03-09-2017   #73
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Re: The Supernatural

Quote Originally Posted by Mithras View Post
The word paradise etymologically descends from the Avestan word pairidaeza, meaning "walled garden", and was most likely an influence on the tranquil descriptions of Garden of Eden.

Moreover, the word magic derives from the Greek phrase "magike tekhne", and it refers to the "art of Zoroastrian priests", such as their divinatory, astrological, and alchemical practices.


Yes, of course. But what is the origin of the meaning of the word? That the signifier was once Persian does not make the signified so.

"What can a thing do with a thing, when it is a thing?"
-Shaykh Ibn Al 'Arabi
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Old 03-09-2017   #74
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Re: The Supernatural

Quote Originally Posted by Ibrahim View Post
Yes, of course. But what is the origin of the meaning of the word? That the signifier was once Persian does not make the signified so.
The meaning of the Avestan (which is not Persian) word is "enclosed/walled garden" and was most likely an influence to descriptions of Garden of Eden:

GARDEN i. ACHAEMENID PERIOD – Encyclopaedia Iranica (this goes in better depth)

Correction: After thinking more, I believe the idea of paradise associated exclusively with gardens came by way of Sumerians first, but the idea of an earthy paradise associated with 'leisure' or 'goodness' descends from Zoroastrian influence.

I recommend reading Anders Hultgård's chapter "Zoroastrian Influences on Judaism, Christianity and Islam" in Mihael Sausberg's Zarathustra and Zoroastrianism (pp. 101-112). It's the most up-to-date scholarly research.

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Old 03-14-2017   #75
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Re: The Supernatural

We can't even explain the fundamentals of physics, let alone explain how they would account for a materialistic view of the mind. It seems to me, we have to be open to the unexplainable as unexplainable.

Materialism alone cannot explain the riddle of consciousness | Aeon Essays

"What lay behind me was no longer any normal, familiar life, that everyday life out of which the impulse to pray raises us, with still at the back of our minds that whensoever we wish we can return. A void was behind me. And in front a wall, a wall of darkness." Georges Bernanos, The Diary of a Country Priest

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Old 03-14-2017   #76
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Re: The Supernatural

But if the unexplainable is unexplainable, can you explain its unexplainability in explainable terms?

"The world is indeed comic, but the joke is on mankind." - H. P. Lovecraft
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Old 03-14-2017   #77
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Re: The Supernatural

Quote Originally Posted by Arthur Staaz View Post
We can't even explain the fundamentals of physics, let alone explain how they would account for a materialistic view of the mind. It seems to me, we have to be open to the unexplainable as unexplainable.

Materialism alone cannot explain the riddle of consciousness | Aeon Essays
Chomsky also argued the Hard Problem of Consciousness "doesn't make sense, since there is no cogent way to frame the physical at all - physics, he says, has no definition of 'the physical' since it abandoned contact mechanics with Newton - so he says the question 'is the brain, or this table, physical' doesn't make sense, since nothing is physical, there are just different parts of the world that we try and make sense of. His essay 'Naturalism and Dualism in the Study of Language and the Mind' makes his position clear" (Brain Science Podcast, 2011).

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Old 03-14-2017   #78
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Re: The Supernatural

Quote Originally Posted by Revenant View Post
But if the unexplainable is unexplainable, can you explain its unexplainability in explainable terms?
I'll let The Who explain it for me.


"What lay behind me was no longer any normal, familiar life, that everyday life out of which the impulse to pray raises us, with still at the back of our minds that whensoever we wish we can return. A void was behind me. And in front a wall, a wall of darkness." Georges Bernanos, The Diary of a Country Priest

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