MWINYD Snippet

[dr. locrian]

Quote ( View Quotes )
A: There is no grand scheme of things. B: If there were a grand scheme of things, the fact - the fact - that we are not equipped to perceive it, either by natural or supernatural means, is a nightmarish obscenity. C: The very notion of a grand scheme of things is a nightmarish obscenity.       Thomas Ligotti - “My Work Is Not Yet Done” Added by: dr. locrian on 06-09-2007 #1

My best friend (now and of olde), Aether, brought this quote to my mind just a bit ago, and I think it bears some meditation and even perhaps some discussion.

Thoughts?

--Doctor Locrian

[Aetherwing]

Jumping Jehosaphat!

I'm ready to delve into this one...but I'm going to wait to see what others may think about it, first.

Briefly, though: This may be one of the most disturbing ideas I've ever read. I'll elaborate on this in my next post.

-Out of the Transplutonic Orb,
Aether.

[Aetherwing]

Man...I was really hoping this one would get a lively discussion going...any takers?

Soaring Upon the Pinions of Outer Night,
Aether

[Dr. Bantham]

am tempted to do such at the moment, however...

I am too intoxicated to have a go at conveying my quasi-intellectual take yet not intoxicated enough to shed my coat of many inhibitions.

Plopping globules of derision into incestuous pools of stagnation,
~Brian Edward Poe~

P.S.
Alright, I admit it. I am too drunk for fleeting moments of clarity.
Oh, dear. It is a weeknight, at that.
birth comma school comma work coma death period

[matt cardin]

I'll only comment that the idea and feeling being conveyed in the quotation at hand isn't necessarily nightmarish. But it is post-modern through and through. It is simply Lyotard's "incredulity toward metanarratives" augmented by an element of horror at the very idea that a metanarrative, a "grand scheme" or big picture or overarching cosmic/ontological "story," might exist outside of our awareness.

To explicate: The narrator of MWINYD is expressing the idea that there isn't any sort of narrative thread that binds together and gives coherent meaning to life and existence. Even the general idea of "life" is too binding and organizing to suit the fact of our entrapment within our respective subjectivities. There are simply lives, and more specifically, there is for each of us just this life, at this moment, consisting of these present phenomenological facts of perception and consciousness, whatever they may be. Things simply are what they are in their immediacy and particularity, with no underlying or supervening thread of meaning to impart any sort of coherence to them.

While I don't see this idea as being inherently nightmarish, the full quotation from MWINYD does leave the door open for a deep feeling of nightmarish unsettlement at the recognition that, given the above-described state of affairs, there is no way that we could perceive a "grand scheme of things" even if it should happen to exist. And my personal feeling is that this constitutes a "nightmarish obscenity" on two related counts: first, because it means that even if there is an ultimate meaning to things, we are categorically shut off from the possibility of knowing it (the horror of ultimate ignorance); and second, because it subtly implies that if there is an ultimate meaning and we cannot know it, then it may well be nightmarish, malevolent, or otherwise awful from our constricted points of view (the horror of something horrible going on behind our backs and outside of our control).

In this respect, I see the quotation as flowing right from the same darkly radiant thematic and philosophical core that has given birth to the bulk of Tom's work. Just as the metaphysical idea of cosmic forces that "play" relentlessly with reality as presented in CRAMPTON shares a direct kinship with the idea of the Great Chemists and their reshaping of matter in Tom's first published story, "The Chymist," so this idea from MWINYD shares a kinship with both, and also with a host of his other stories. It expresses an idea, and more importantly, a vivid intellectual-emotional experience, that lies at the very heart of his tortured, horrified view of life and the universe. Because of this, I see it as yet another refinement of his overall philosophical or spiritual "message," just as I see most of his stories over time representing similar refinements.

So I suppose in the course of my stream of consciousness ramblings here, I have revised my initial assertion above, that this quotation isn't necessarily nightmarish. More correctly, as I see it, it necessarily leaves the door open for a suspicion of nightmare. This may be an obsessively hair-splitting way of putting it, but it's the interpretation that works for me, because I have myself experienced, at times, overpowering intimations of the very same thought-feeling that pervades the quote.

	MWINYD My Work Is Not Yet Done

[dr. locrian]

Hey, guys. I came upon this months old response and characteristically superb explication by Matt of the quote above. I will respond only to a few sentences of it (as I am pressed for time):

Quote Originally Posted by Matt Cardin";p=&quot

And my personal feeling is that this constitutes a "nightmarish obscenity" on two related counts: first, because it means that even if there is an ultimate meaning to things, we are categorically shut off from the possibility of knowing it (the horror of ultimate ignorance); and second, because it subtly implies that if there is an ultimate meaning and we cannot know it, then it may well be nightmarish, malevolent, or otherwise awful from our constricted points of view (the horror of something horrible going on behind our backs and outside of our control).

In musing on TL's MWINYD quote in this context, I would state that, personally, only Option C ("The very notion of a grand scheme of things is a nightmarish obscenity.") seems truly horrifying to me.

Here's why.

Option A ("There is no grand scheme of things") is something of a comfort, albeit a bleak one. I can live with the idea that we are born, live and die with no "grand" purpose. It's actually somewhat comforting to me, and certainly allows me to live my life on my own terms without the burden of a "grand scheme" philosophy. The choices I make are my own--or as in the words of a famous puppet: "I've got no strings to hold me down."

Option B ("If there were a grand scheme of things, the fact—the fact—that we are not equipped to perceive it, either by natural or supernatural means, is a nightmarish obscenity") doesn't seem as bad to me as it does to poor old Frank. If there IS a higher force pulling the strings of our lives (see Option C below), I really don't want to know about it. Perhaps I lack that kind of irrepressible curiosity, but I don't WANT to see what's behind THAT curtain! Maybe I've simply read too many Lovecraftian stories, but from Gilman to Wilmarth, sometimes the best advice is not to look too closely at the gears and pulleys backstage. I'm perfectly happy being ignorant of my place as a tiny cog in the "grand" machine of existence. And if I fundamentally lack the facilities to do so, so much the better. That's a relief!

Option C, though, is (potentially) both nightmarish and obscene to me. This Option could be alluding to the idea that any "grand scheme" would be as gibbering and mindless and intrinsically malevolent as Lovecraft's Azathoth. That's bad.

OTOH, even without the horror of a Lovecraftian worldview, ANY god(s) behind the scenes would be (potentially) monstrous for the miasma of pain and horror that it/they have produced. I have always inwardly flinched when someone has told me that something was part of "God's plan." For one thing, usually that something was horrible (someone or something's death or dying)--and, even more importantly--not to get into the idea of predestination--this "Plan" idea necessarily suggests that there is no free will. Whether Azathoth or Zeus is the god in question, we are no better than puppets if there is actually "a Grand Scheme." I've never been able to wrap my head around the concept that God (in whatever form) could be omni-everything and still keep Its hands off of our individual choices. If someThing controls every end result then It knows (and, directly or indirectly) controls what we do, think, and feel. I can't for the life of me think of anything more obscene or nightmarish than this concept (which is mercifully hard for me to ponder for any length of time).

Give me a Creator who is strictly hands off and (by Its choice or not) not omnipotent! Sure, if It wants to comfort me for some reason, fine; wants to "give me strength" to handle certain situations, ok. But I do NOT want It to find my car keys or be responsible for child molestation and genocide. What a horror that idea is to me.

Quote Originally Posted by Matt Cardin";p=&quot

Just as the metaphysical idea of cosmic forces that "play" relentlessly with reality as presented in CRAMPTON shares a direct kinship with the idea of the Great Chemists and their reshaping of matter in Tom's first published story, "The Chymist," so this idea from MWINYD shares a kinship with both, and also with a host of his other stories.

That is so true, and both works you mentioned are great examples. This to me is quite simply the horror of being a character in a TL story. Ironically, in "real life" Tom is quite a great fellow, but, as the Author--metafictionally speaking, of course--he is a God-like force manipulating and torturing his creations with unheard of creative malevolence. At the same time, his characters are PART of their Creator's consciousness--ala "Dream of a Mannikin"--so the punishment inflicted is both sadistic and masochistic simultaneously.

It's very easy for me to put myself in the unfortunate shoes of Mr. Veech, for instance, or dozens of Ligotti characters.

The intrinsic irony is that there IS a "Grand Scheme of things" in Frank Dominio's world: that of the Author himself. And Frank is the hapless receptacle through which that Author produces and channels all his hideous schemes.

How terrible it would be to realize that we are products--dream things--in one of Tom's amazing and horrible tales.

Yikes. Sorry for the wordy response!

Work Not Done!

--Dr. Locrian

	MWINYD My Work Is Not Yet Done

[dr. locrian]

What an irony that my post above was written less than a month before Katrina would so radically change the life of every New Orleanian (myself included). Grand Scheme of Things or no, I can do without the Author's malevolent chaos chomping on and around the stability of my life, thanks very much!

Now is as good a time as any to mention that a good friend of mine and fellow actor here in New Orleans, Gavin Mahlie, passed away of unknown causes about a week ago (though we're all pretty sure it was a heart attack as he had some related trouble in the recent past). He died (apparently) in his sleep. Gavin was 41 years old.

Last year he played Shylock and Iago in the Shakespeare Festival at Tulane. His Shylock particularly was awe-inspiring and incredibly moving. He was simply the best actor I've ever worked with (or seen on stage), and he was perhaps the most decent human being I've ever met.

See below for more details about Gavin. He will be missed by New Orleans--and by me and his many friends--tremendously.

[web:960c891f4f]http://www.nola.com/search/index.ssf?/base/living-6/114473595611400.xml?nola[/web:960c891f4f]

R.I.P. Gavin.

[SwansSoilMe/SwansSaveMe]

Yes, R.I.P. And I hope you are well, Doctor...

In relation to the above comments from last year: Years ago in Systematic Theology class, I posited that God could not know the future, could not have "foreknowledge," because that would mean he necessarily created the known. To help people get it, I asked, "Why would God create someone whom he knew would end up in hell?" The response was that he gives us free will, yet knows what our free will is going to be. Typical nonsense. Later on, this heretic went up against the sacrosanct doctrines of eternal hell itself and of original sin. It was a Pentecostal Bible college.