The Supernatural

[Robert Adam Gilmour]

Quote Originally Posted by Robert Adam Gilmour

For atheists like myself it just doesn't come up very often because it isn't interesting or unusual. Just like I don't announce to people that I'm heterosexual.

I felt like walking this back a bit. Maybe I/some people shouldn't be so judgemental of atheists who wear it loudly, because people tend to be proud of a part of their identity when other people insist it's unacceptable. Opressively religious societies might seem distant to a lot of us but it's still a reality to a lot of people.

[Ibrahim]

Quote Originally Posted by Robert Adam Gilmour

Quote Originally Posted by Robert Adam Gilmour For atheists like myself it just doesn't come up very often because it isn't interesting or unusual. Just like I don't announce to people that I'm heterosexual. I felt like walking this back a bit. Maybe I/some people shouldn't be so judgemental of atheists who wear it loudly, because people tend to be proud of a part of their identity when other people insist it's unacceptable. Opressively religious societies might seem distant to a lot of us but it's still a reality to a lot of people.

I'd argue that right now, some of us are living in oppresively irreligious societies. Oppression is not distant to me, i know the boot end of it no less than people who've had an oppresive Catholic childhood, and it was no less a struggle for me to get out from under the atheist norm than it was a struggle for them with the theist norm.
Oppression can take the form of imposed 'freedom.'

[qcrisp]

http://oldarchive.godspy.com/issues/...earce.cfm.html

Quote

In spite of the profound effect of Buddhist teaching upon his general outlook, Schumacher's return to England 'was not marked by an intensification of his study of Eastern religions'. Instead he concentrated his efforts on a thorough study of Christian thought, particularly St. Thomas Aquinas, and modern writers such as Rene Guenon and Jacques Maritain. He also began to read the Christian mystics and the lives of the saints. Although he still did not consider himself a Christian his previously hostile attitude had softened. One result of this was that his wife, who came from a devout Lutheran background, could take their children to church without fear of her husband's objections. Schumacher first publicly stated his new orientation in a broadcast talk in May 1957 in which he criticized a much-acclaimed book by Charles Frankel, entitled The Case for Modern Man. He called his talk 'The Insufficiency of Liberalism' and it was an exposition of what he termed the 'three stages of development'. The first great leap, he said, was made when man moved from stage one of primitive religiosity to stage two of scientific realism. This was the stage modern man tended to be at. Then, he said, some people become dissatisfied with scientific realism, perceiving its deficiencies, and realize that there is something beyond fact and science. Such people progress to a higher plane of development which he called stage three. The problem, he explained, was that stage one and stage three looked exactly the same to those in stage two. Consequently, those in stage three are seen as having had some sort of brainstorm, a relapse into childish nonsense. Only those in stage three, who have been through stage two, can understand the difference between stage one and stage three.

[qcrisp]

YouTube

Indeed, I felt I had to.

[qcrisp]

Just to be clear, precisely the argument in question changed my entire worldview. As recently as 2013, I remember arguing for subjectivism. Scrutinising the above argument, in conversation and writing, and actually engaging with the argument, led me to realise that to argue for the truth of subjectivism was an absurdity. I gave it up and the world now looks really quite different to me.

[Revenant]

I used to be highly critical of those who took drugs. I never understood the allure. Then I got injured once and was given Oxycodone for the pain. Then I got it. I fully understand now.

[Evans]

Sadly I haven't yet been able to try DMT (if the cosmos wishes to provide some at this point it would be much appreciated) but I have consumed a fair amount of LSD and Psilocybin, sometimes in near heroic doses. Whilst - providing certain precautions are taken - it's something I'd recommend*, I can't say it has produced anything akin to a religious experience. For me a successful psychedelic experience will inspire a burst of metaphysical/ontological musings in a non-linear way, but that's more about uninhibiting my mind than granting it a special visionary perspective on external reality.

*Actually for me it's far preferable to alcohol. Psychedelics tend to induce an attitude of universal benevolence and rambling existential questioning whilst alcohol just makes you angry and prone to say things that will later be regretted.

These things are too hard to get though.

Well, some religions begin with immense bloodshed, such as creating blood mills of innocents, beheading, taxing unbelievers, and slaughtering revered dogs. Their followers also continue speaking of such historical events proudly, given the import of their founders' actions, and go as far as creating films that positively portray such a genocide. The kind-hearted followers who contemplate on such a religion's history are bound to abandon it, but this normally does not occur due to either ignorance or ethnic ties as they continue to circumambulate a demonic black stone.

[paeng]

Some did, but in relation to visits to places that are important to poor, religious folk, then supplemented by books and videos on mythology, etc.

[Ibrahim]

Robert: i am sensitive to your point about the evil being in the man rather than in the system. The question remains, what kind of tools are there, which might, when applied well, have a chance of facilitating that clear view of the inner self & of bringing forth its most benevolent aspects?

There's no telling how we would function if capitalism were actually successfully replaced- success in this regard would be quite a paradigm-shattering event that would probably entail a complete 'rewiring'of the brain.

But, to stick to the original subject, i haven't ever imagined there was an actual historical claim to Machen's ( & later on, Robert E. Howard's) mythologizing about the black stone and its cult.
Plot-based supernatural fiction in general seems rather materialistic in nature anyway; it's the atmosphere that counts. That transports.